Readers may, or may not, know that in the skeptic/atheist blogosphere there are lots of arguments going on, a lot of it focused on FreeThoughtsBlogs and Skepchick, such that some have taken to calling them FreeThoughtBullies. Most of this stems over arguments over sexism and misogyny within the atheist/skeptic movement, which is an a problem.
I've not followed all of the arguments, because there are 24 hours in a day, and (especially as the whole thing's rather dispiriting) I'd much rather spend my time doing other things. One of which is reading articles on FTB, amongst other things. I'm not as regular reader as I used to be, but I like to dip in and out, and when I did, tt was a shame to read that the arguments over FTB have led to Jen McCreight hanging up her blogging hat for the indefinite future - it was she that got the Atheism+ thing moving.
A lot of people seem to poor vitriol on FreeThoughtsBlogs for their "bullying" behaviour. Now, as I've said, I've not been able to keep up with all the flame wars over this in the blogosphere, but when an anti-FTB sentiment like this pops up in my blog roll, it seems full of accusations, but empty of actual evidence for their claims, yet when I read about what's happening on the other side I'm genuinely shocked that people can act in such a way. It makes the "FreeThoughtBullies" thing seem laughable.
Even in the case of Thunderf00t, a blogger who joined FreeThoughtsBlogs, but left in acrimonious circumstances, reading his version of events vs the FTB version of events, it seems to me that FTB is the more reasonable side, and not deserving of the abuse.
It's not easy being on the end of vitriol and bullying, and whilst there's not much I can do, speaking out against bullies is something I can do. So I just thought I'd spend a moment to stick up for a bunch of bloggers whose posts I've been reading of and on for years because they've highlighted stories that have informed me, entertained me, and made me think.
It's a shame to see Jen McCreight go, but I hope the buggers don't grind the rest of you down.
Just an idea, but if you want to proof that there is a problem with sexism and misogyny you should find a source that is unbiased, not link to a skepchick post for proof.
ReplyDeleteOtherwise, let me show you the bible to proof that there is a God.
"I haven't actually been paying attention to what's been going on, but I've formed an opinion based on the little snippets I've read and my existing biases."
ReplyDeleteI always found it funny that people think desecrating the holy communion was perfectly fine and alright but asking someone out for a cup of coffee on an elevator ( and then taking NO for an answer with out any issues) is considering positively inhumane and dangerous.
ReplyDeletePZ Myers was good fun to read about 5 or 6 years ago for me. Post that he has become a bully and has just grown more arrogant.
I am guessing that people just joining up into groups is just a bad thing no matter what the cause is. Divisiveness is just one of those human things I guess.
asking someone out for a cup of coffee on an elevator ( and then taking NO for an answer with out any issues) is considering positively inhumane and dangerous.
ReplyDeleteNo one ever said it was. This is what's called a straw man, and it's the reason the side promoting it (the anti-FTB/Skepchick side) has no credibility.
snowrunner - granted, it was a Skepchick article, but if it's only a Skepchick article that picks up on rape threats to a teenage girl who expresses enthusiasm for a Carl Sagan book, then yes, there's a problem.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous the First - Yes, that's exactly it. I've been open and expressed how I feel. From what I've seen, I don't think FreeThoughtBlogs or Skepchick are in the wrong. I will change my opinion given better evidence. I've just not seen any yet.
Anonymous the Second - "I always found it funny that people think desecrating the holy communion was perfectly fine and alright but asking someone out for a cup of coffee on an elevator ( and then taking NO for an answer with out any issues) is considering positively inhumane and dangerous." I've not said that. But really, if you can't see the problem with asking women to your hotel room in an elevator in the early hours, you need to understand how that is a creepy thing to do, and that it is something that is best avoided.
Anonymous the Third - Thank you.
It's quite a jump from an online forum like reddit to make the leap that the community itself is infested with it. Only someone who never gets out of the house and thinks the internet is the real world would really think that.
DeleteOh, as for that girl btw, she's turned Christian recently (I got curious and checked her reddit name). The reasons given? She was an atheist because she felt lonely and then didn't find a community. Her current church gives her that though.
So yeah, we lost one, but it wasn't because the community is per-se "hostile" or sexist or misogynistic (that one is extreme hyperbole by the Watsonites anyway. It means HATE OF WOMEN, but for Watson et. al. anybody who disagrees with them does so because they are a woman. See the reason why so many people push back against the A+ crowd?
Anyway, I digress. If you want to show that the community as a whole has this problem find a study that asserts that. I am pretty certain you won't find that as many other women have said themselves. Oh yeah, the end result one of that was that they were being shamed, called Gender traitor etc. and in one case at least they also dragged Dawkins with into it because he dared to re-tweet that tweet.
Oh, and as a great example how the A+ cult reacts when you ask them some serious questions, watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_M7w5xmtZU&feature=plcp